Keyser_Soze Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 That Ron Reagan commercial doe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Oh, also, wage subsidies are a panacea to keep people working, period, when really workers deserve some sort of representation in management decisions. Wage subsidies do nothing to alter the fundamental power imbalance in American working life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 4 minutes ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: If you raised their wages, they'd have robots. If their health insurance became too costly, they'd have robots. If it were marginally cheaper in a three year time frame than to hire any human, there'd be robots. The only reason people talk to longingly about good manufacturing jobs is because of the threat and actual gains made in that industry by unions, whose rose to power in a time that is never returning. It's pure nostalgia Then have the courage to tell everyone that the factories are closed and things will never be the same. 1 minute ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: Oh, also, wage subsidies are a panacea to keep people working, period, when really workers deserve some sort of representation in management decisions Wage subsides coupled with a negative income tax would do a lot of good. Nothing is a panacea. A wealth tax isn't the panacea that Warren and Sanders make it out to be. Ask the European nations that tried it a few decades ago how it went. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Gabbard: Fine people on both sides. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-El814 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 5 minutes ago, Massdriver said: Then have the courage to tell everyone that the factories are closed and things will never be the same. If more people had the courage to commit political suicide there’d be fewer than 12 people on stage tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 13 minutes ago, Massdriver said: Then have the courage to tell everyone that the factories are closed and things will never be the same. Wage subsides coupled with a negative income tax would do a lot of good. Nothing is a panacea. A wealth tax isn't the panacea that Warren and Sanders make it out to be. Ask the European nations that tried it a few decades ago how it went. The biggest issue with Warren's tax is constitutional, not administrative or efficacy (And her wealth tax was formed with the European failures in mind) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Iirc, the wealthy would itemize and self declare the value of their assets. The catch is the government would have the ability to purchase (via eminent domain) any or all of those assets at the value declared by the wealthy person. This plus actual, vigorous enforcement of income taxes on the wealthy would go a long way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: The biggest issue with Warren's tax is constitutional, not administrative or efficacy The evidence from Europe indicates the opposite. I realize her plan has more teeth, but it's untested in the U.S., and all the data shows it is inefficient and hard to administer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Just now, Massdriver said: The evidence from Europe indicates the opposite. I realize her plan has more teeth, but it's untested in the U.S., and all the data shows it is inefficient and hard to administer. There are still European countries that have a wealth tax, the US already has one type of wealth tax, and also see my other post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Tom Steyer talking now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: There are still European countries that have a wealth tax, the US already has one type of wealth tax, and also see my other post There are, but most of the countries that had them got rid of them. If you're referring to a property tax, you know that a wealth tax as Warren proposes and a property tax are administered completely differently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jwheel86 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Beto is having a good night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 20 minutes ago, Massdriver said: There are, but most of the countries that had them got rid of them. If you're referring to a property tax, you know that a wealth tax as Warren proposes and a property tax are administered completely differently. 30 minutes ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: Iirc, the wealthy would itemize and self declare the value of their assets. The catch is the government would have the ability to purchase (via eminent domain) any or all of those assets at the value declared by the wealthy person. This plus actual, vigorous enforcement of income taxes on the wealthy would go a long way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Shots fired at Bing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 11 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said: Shots fired at Bing! Andrew Yang is dropping bombs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mclumber1 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Warren: Making abortion illegal won't stop people from having abortions. Everyone on the stage: Making assault weapons illegal will stop people from using assault weapons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-El814 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, mclumber1 said: Warren: Making abortion illegal won't stop people from having abortions. Everyone on the stage: Making assault weapons illegal will stop people from using assault weapons HURRRRRRRRRRRRR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mclumber1 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Kal-El814 said: HURRRRRRRRRRRRR I'll be here all night folks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mclumber1 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Warren: "I know executive authority, and I will abuse it." I'm pretty sure that's what she said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 16 minutes ago, mclumber1 said: Warren: Making abortion illegal won't stop people from having abortions. Everyone on the stage: Making assault weapons illegal will stop people from using assault weapons Tiny American flags for some, assault weapon abortions for others. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mclumber1 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Jason said: Tiny American flags for some, assault weapon abortions for others. Found the centrist! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osxmatt Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 19 minutes ago, mclumber1 said: Warren: Making abortion illegal won't stop people from having abortions. Everyone on the stage: Making assault weapons illegal will stop people from using assault weapons Banning items is typically more successful than banning actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mclumber1 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Just now, osxmatt said: Banning items is typically more successful than banning actions. Excuse me while I buy a gram of cocaine from a guy in my complex. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mclumber1 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Hey, do you guys know when someone is a vegan? They'll tell you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, mclumber1 said: Excuse me while I buy a gram of cocaine from a guy in my complex. Go buy a Cuban cigar while you're at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-El814 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 5 minutes ago, johnny said: It’s so weird that a man who put falafel on someone’s vagina finds it difficult to believe another person might know someone who... *checks notes*... works a few jobs. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedSoxFan9 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted October 16, 2019 Author Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted October 16, 2019 Author Share Posted October 16, 2019 6 hours ago, johnny said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Bernie mentioned climate change in passing assuming there was going to be a question about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork3245 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Warren clearly wasn’t prepped (at least mot well) to respond to being attacked. I still think she had a good night overall. Kamala going after her about banning Trump’s Twitter account was just silly, IMO. I get the overall point Kamala was making, but lordy, that was weak. I think Warren needs a better response to the tax increase thing. I like how she refuses to give the sound byte of “yes”, but I also see how not directly giving a yes or no is beginning to appear “evasive” to some. It’s important that she continues to focus on the overall point that any increase in taxes will still be less per year than what the average American is paying overall in taxes + healthcare costs, but she needs to simplify the answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commodore D Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 10 hours ago, Keyser_Soze said: Shots fired at Bing! He doesn’t know about these reward points, and not paying for video games. Just another case of the rich not knowing the common man’s life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signifyin(g)Monkey Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 10 hours ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: The threat of automation vis a vi AI is vastly overblown given how much of the economy and current jobs are service based. These people just need higher wages. Actually there’s a giant con job going on in discussions of AI and automation, much of it stemming from people either not being honest about or not knowing how AI really works. AIs aren’t some stand-alone superbeings from Mars. In order to work, they need access to vast amounts of data—and for the AIs of the future to work, because they will be serving people, this data will need to be generated *by people*. And for truly advanced service AIs to get access to this data, they will need access to an open network—the internet/cloud. The problem is that we don’t pay people for their data. We insist that it’s okay to take it from them, using the open network, without compensating them for it. If that persists, then as people get put out of work by efficiency gains in AI, we’re going to have to face up to the fact that we’re doing something pretty dishonest: we’re telling people ‘you’re obsolete, so I shouldn’t have to pay you’, and then saying ‘but I need your data’, and hoping people don’t realize that the latter statement contradicts the first, and that those who own and operate the AIs can get that data without having to pay for it. If instead we become honest in our accounting, and pay people for the value they create, and for the manner in which their data serves as the ‘fuel’ for AIs, then we might not even need things like UBI. People could just make a living by producing useful data and gaining benefits from the ‘data market’ rather than a government subsidy, which produces all sorts of problems when it’s the only source of income for vast swathes of the population—it would be a labor market paradigm which would be much better suited for the economy of the future. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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