Rock the Vote '24: update (09/10) - It's "Debate Night" - do yourself a favor and play a video game instead

[LazyPiranha]

To me the biggest problem with defecting Republicans is less the idea that people and beliefs can’t change with time and more that these people still hold beliefs I find repugnant but they just really dislike Trump for harming the chances of their preferred beliefs winning.  

[mclumber1]

41 minutes ago, LazyPiranha said:

To me the biggest problem with defecting Republicans is less the idea that people and beliefs can’t change with time and more that these people still hold beliefs I find repugnant but they just really dislike Trump for harming the chances of their preferred beliefs winning.  

 

Many of you gave me a virtual pat on the back when I indicated I'd likely vote for Harris in November, despite not being a Democrat myself, and despite disagreeing with her on a number of issues. 

 

So I just think it's interesting how you all are accepting of my decision, but feel it necessary to shit all over people like Kinzinger and Cheney for basically doing the same thing I'm doing.  

 

My dudes, take the W.

 

Stop the gate keeping, especially when you need every vote you can get. 

 

Battle with Kinzinger, Cheney, and mclumber1 AFTER the election.  

[TheBladeRoden]

Has it finally been settled whether the mics will be on or not?

[S3xB0t]

9 hours ago, ihavebigtitties said:

When Republicans endorses Trump you call them cowards. When a Republican endorses Harris you call them a grifter.

 

You men are never happy.

spade is a spade

[Spork3245]

42 minutes ago, mclumber1 said:

 

Many of you gave me a virtual pat on the back when I indicated I'd likely vote for Harris in November, despite not being a Democrat myself, and despite disagreeing with her on a number of issues. 

 

So I just think it's interesting how you all are accepting of my decision, but feel it necessary to shit all over people like Kinzinger and Cheney for basically doing the same thing I'm doing.  

 

My dudes, take the W.

 

Stop the gate keeping, especially when you need every vote you can get. 

 

Battle with Kinzinger, Cheney, and mclumber1 AFTER the election.  

 

[Reputator]

1 hour ago, LazyPiranha said:

To me the biggest problem with defecting Republicans is less the idea that people and beliefs can’t change with time and more that these people still hold beliefs I find repugnant but they just really dislike Trump for harming the chances of their preferred beliefs winning.  

 

They have a VERY good chance of their beliefs winning under Trump. It's still a statistical tie in many places.

 

I do think some of them genuinely view Trump as a threat to the nation's stability and the constitution. You can call it virtue signaling if you want, but a number of them bring a lot of risk to themselves by speaking out, not just politically. They've faced threats of violence.

[mclumber1]

[Spork3245]

3 minutes ago, mclumber1 said:

 

I bet their tune will change if Wyoming goes blue by 1 vote!

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

Just now, Spork3245 said:

 

I bet their tune will change if Wyoming goes blue by 1 vote!

If WY goes blue I’ll eat dog shit with a spoon

[Spork3245]

Just now, b_m_b_m_b_m said:

If WY goes blue I’ll eat dog shit with a spoon

 

Only if it's by 1 vote, which was clearly Cheney's. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

You go to war with the allies you actually have, not the allies you wish you had.

[LazyPiranha]

1 hour ago, mclumber1 said:

 

Many of you gave me a virtual pat on the back when I indicated I'd likely vote for Harris in November, despite not being a Democrat myself, and despite disagreeing with her on a number of issues. 

 

So I just think it's interesting how you all are accepting of my decision, but feel it necessary to shit all over people like Kinzinger and Cheney for basically doing the same thing I'm doing.  

 

My dudes, take the W.

 

Stop the gate keeping, especially when you need every vote you can get. 

 

Battle with Kinzinger, Cheney, and mclumber1 AFTER the election.  

I’m not battling you.  There are two different situations.  You’re a person who, from what little I can tell, has looked at the issues and has decided that the positions of Trump aren’t appealing to you and has decided to vote against them.  That’s admirable, and that’s why you get the pat on the back.  You personally have nothing to gain or lose from your decision, it’s purely a personal one based on your own ideas.

 

The other situation are career republicans who still want 90% of what Trump wants, but maybe not the other 10% or maybe not the way he’s doing it.  For people like Cheney, it’s a win/win for them.  Their disavowal of Trump costs them basically nothing personally or politically, realistically hardly moves the needle in terms of actual votes, and if Trump wins regardless you still get the majority of what you want politically.  
 

Also, you could very easily see people being annoyed by the ever increasing lean of dems to the right to try and scoop up people like Cheney as yet more abandoning of actual liberal polices to cater to the mythical middle, but that’s a different conversation.

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

15 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

You go to war with the allies you actually have, not the allies you wish you had.

Thanks Don Rumsfeld 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

6 minutes ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said:

Thanks Don Rumsfeld 

 

I was definitely channeling him with that one!

[Jason]

21 minutes ago, LazyPiranha said:

I’m not battling you.  There are two different situations.  You’re a person who, from what little I can tell, has looked at the issues and has decided that the positions of Trump aren’t appealing to you and has decided to vote against them.  That’s admirable, and that’s why you get the pat on the back.  You personally have nothing to gain or lose from your decision, it’s purely a personal one based on your own ideas.

 

The other situation are career republicans who still want 90% of what Trump wants, but maybe not the other 10% or maybe not the way he’s doing it.  For people like Cheney, it’s a win/win for them.  Their disavowal of Trump costs them basically nothing personally or politically, realistically hardly moves the needle in terms of actual votes, and if Trump wins regardless you still get the majority of what you want politically.  
 

Also, you could very easily see people being annoyed by the ever increasing lean of dems to the right to try and scoop up people like Cheney as yet more abandoning of actual liberal polices to cater to the mythical middle, but that’s a different conversation.

 

Also I maybe I'm wrong but I think everyone assumed mclumber was planning on voting Libertarian Party before he decided to vote for Harris, not for Trump. 

[mrbiggsly]

2 hours ago, TheBladeRoden said:

Has it finally been settled whether the mics will be on or not?

Harris campaign agrees to muted mics in debate against Trump

WWW.CBSNEWS.COM

---

A candidate's microphone will be muted when it's their opponent's turn to answer a question.

 

[GeneticBlueprint]

54 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

Also I maybe I'm wrong but I think everyone assumed mclumber was planning on voting Libertarian Party before he decided to vote for Harris, not for Trump. 

But he’s helping ensure victory by voting for Harris. Doesn’t matter if he wasn’t voting for Trump. 

[Air_Delivery]

My point was if you still call yourself a Republican you identify with the party who has for 9 years put their full weight to not only Trump but a host of other terrible people you implicitly accept the things they do. "Tradtional" republicans barely exist anymore. And they nominated him again despite literally trying to violently overthrow the government. Republicans did that whether you support Trump or not. Its like wearing a Nazi uniform and saying "I didn't support everything they did, but I really like their economic policies".. 

 

Its fine not liking Democrats and feel like you are chosing the least bad option but at least call yourself an independent. 

[MarSolo]

4 hours ago, Spork3245 said:

Are the Nazi generals who tried to assassinate Hitler not Nazis? It’s entirely possible for someone to love the ideals and policies of something without liking the current leadership.

Shit, there are Indiana Jones movies about this very subject. 

[MarSolo]

3 hours ago, mclumber1 said:

 

Many of you gave me a virtual pat on the back when I indicated I'd likely vote for Harris in November, despite not being a Democrat myself, and despite disagreeing with her on a number of issues. 

 

So I just think it's interesting how you all are accepting of my decision, but feel it necessary to shit all over people like Kinzinger and Cheney for basically doing the same thing I'm doing.  

 

My dudes, take the W.

 

Stop the gate keeping, especially when you need every vote you can get. 

 

Battle with Kinzinger, Cheney, and mclumber1 AFTER the election.  

Also this.

 

I keep trying to explain this to the “Genocide Joe and Killer Kamala” crowd. Yeah, it legit sucks what’s going on in Gaza, but don’t burn your own house down because the neighbor across the street is beating his wife and your own wife/husband won’t do anything about it.

[skillzdadirecta]

3 hours ago, mclumber1 said:

My dudes, take the W.

 

Stop the gate keeping, especially when you need every vote you can get. 

 

Battle with Kinzinger, Cheney, and mclumber1 AFTER the election.  

Dear god this! Michelle Obama LITERALLY said this during the convention. Have you guys never heard the saying "The enemy of my enemy is my friend?" We literally need every vote we can get... this election is nowhere near a done deal and is pretty fucking close.Closer than it should be.

 

2 hours ago, LazyPiranha said:

Their disavowal of Trump costs them basically nothing personally or politically

REALLY???

 

2 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

I was definitely channeling him with that one!

 

I thought Ned Stark said that!

[PaladinSolo]

Harris raised over $300 million in August, extending cash windfall

WWW.NBCNEWS.COM

---

Money has been pouring into the Democratic presidential campaign since President Joe Biden stepped aside in July.

 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

18 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I thought Ned Stark said that!

 

[PaladinSolo]

I missed that apparently Trump did a "town hall" event with Hannity that was actually just a Hannity interview with an audience, as not a single question was asked from anyone but Hannity, lol. 

[Reputator]

Also the same event where Trump said Biden is on the ballot.

[SaysWho?]

19 hours ago, Uaarkson said:

She’s a fucking grifter like all the rest 

 

19 hours ago, S3xB0t said:

But really she is a piece of shit so…not an election-winning endorsement.

 

19 hours ago, Xbob42 said:

But if a few pieces of shit follow her...

 

19 hours ago, Jason said:

I maintain that Liz is just offended that Trump didn't try to steal the election the right way. Through SCOTUS, like her dad did.

 

19 hours ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said:

She’s got more stones than Romney and Christie or Pence

 

18 hours ago, DPCyric said:

 

She also said this isn't an election you can vote third party or write someone in. She made it clear voting for Harris is what people need to do to stop Trump and protect the Constitution.

 

14 hours ago, ihavebigtitties said:

When Republicans endorses Trump you call them cowards. When a Republican endorses Harris you call them a grifter.

 

You men are never happy.

 

9 hours ago, Spork3245 said:

Eh, much like Kinzinger, she gave up her political career to do the right thing and continues to speak up when necessary. Her politics on policy are typically awful and I’ll never agree with or even remotely like her, but I’ll give respect where and when it’s due. It would’ve much easier for her, and a much bigger and more profitable grift, for her to fall in line with the rest of her colleagues and keep her seat. She chose country over party, career, and politics.

 

6 hours ago, Signifyin(g)Monkey said:

This is sort of where I’m at with the anti-Trumper pols who essentially gave up their careers in the GOP, as well.  Yeah, maybe they’re profiting off of their new heterodox position in the conservative eco-system, but they still deserve props for giving up *actual* political power.  Just an appropriate dab of props—nothing more.

 

There are others I’m also willing to cut some slack in the interest of winning this particular war, because they have above-average insight into the fight against Trump, they don’t have a history of grift, and they seem to have authentically widened their belief systems to encompass a little more progressivism, (at least for now) despite their prior loyalties. Folks like Jonathan V. Last, Tim Miller and Sarah Longwell over at ‘The Bulwark’ for example.  I occasionally enjoy their commentary.

 

But like the the Western bloc fighting the Nazis alongside the Soviets in WW2, I foresee a resumption of hostilities after the common enemy is dispatched.  And there are still neocons at publications like The Bulwark I still simply can’t forgive for their Iraq transgressions and neoliberal excesses, aren’t insightful or interesting enough to be worth the effort of mercy, like Bill Kristol.

 

5 hours ago, mclumber1 said:

 

Ironically, some of the users on this board treat political opinions as the "one drop rule".  They'd rather have a politically homogeneous party than be accepting of newcomers who don't pass the purity test.

 

Just to get in on this conversation:

 

The reason I have respect for Liz Cheney is that so many Republicans speak out after they have no power. She was the number 3 Republican in the House and voted to impeach and continued to speak out against him after the vote. She then was ousted from her position but she never turned back on it. People on the left rightfully think Republicans like a spine by only speaking out after they've lost all power to do anything. She didn't.

 

Now, I've heard the other side of the argument that she's rich and will be fine and she supported Trump prior to Jan. 6, and that's all true. I just think if I'm going to dismiss a Republican for not having the courage to stand up to Trump and his ideology and ilk when that person is in power, I need to not do that when they're one of the most powerful Republicans and stood up against him.

[CitizenVectron]

[CitizenVectron]

 

 

Good results, but PA remains dangerously close.

[S3xB0t]

Just now, CitizenVectron said:

 

 

Good results, but PA remains dangerously close.

I’m not paying any attention to polls until after the debate. 

[Ominous]

1 minute ago, S3xB0t said:

I’m not paying any attention to polls until after the debate. 

What about poles? 

[Best]

I'll help PA as much as I humanely can by voting for Harris in November. 

[S3xB0t]

2 minutes ago, Ominous said:

What about poles? 

Unless my marriage fails in the next 5 days then probably no poles, either.

[Reputator]

5 minutes ago, S3xB0t said:

I’m not paying any attention to polls until after the debate. 

 

I'm really skeptical that a debate can do much or anything when Trump's on the ballot.

[Xbob42]

4 minutes ago, Reputator said:

 

I'm really skeptical that a debate can do much or anything when Trump's on the ballot.

I dunno, the last one we had had a pretty significant impact...

[S3xB0t]

1 minute ago, Reputator said:

 

I'm really skeptical that a debate can do much or anything when Trump's on the ballot.

I do agree, kind of. If she “wins” I think it will cause her popularity to increase as dramatically as it can in a tight race. If she “loses” then it will cause a slight contraction in her popularity, although she will still maintain a non statistically significant advantage. With Dems outspending the GOP pretty much everywhere it will be money that has the final say, not a debate performance.