Television Star Wars: The Acolyte (Disney+), update (08/19): RIP in Peace

[CitizenVectron]

 

Looks okay. I'm guessing it's using the same stage/effects as the rest of the Disney+ Star Wars shows (with the exception of Andor), as it has the same look. That's disappointing, as I hope they go back to using real locations more in the future, like Andor.

[silentbob]

Trailer improved my overall excitement for the series, cause the teaser was only so-so. June’s gonna be a good month for tv with this and The Boys both coming back

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

I originally thought the series was Sith-centric so I was kinda disappointed to find out it wasn't.

[Reputator]

It does look quite a bit better there than it did earlier. It might be worth a sub for a couple months.

[GoldenTongue]

8 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

I originally thought the series was Sith-centric so I was kinda disappointed to find out it wasn't.

I think it kinda is?  Sort of?

 

But my own expectations have become increasingly measured with each trailer that’s come out. This feels as homogenized as many of the other live Star Wars shows from what we’ve seen so far. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

 

 

 

 

[GeneticBlueprint]

It looks so... not good. But also fun! And like I've mentioned elsewhere I'm rooting for Carrie Ann Moss so I'll definitely be watching.

[AbsolutSurgen]

They’ve already cleared the subtitles to get rid of a spoiler. 
 

Spoiler

Amanda Stenberg doesn’t just play Mae, but a character called Osha who professes “they didn’t do it”. 
Somewhat confirming prior rumours of twins, where one was taken by Jedi, other by the Sith. 

 

[johnny]

if this gives us a bunch of cool saber fights i’ll be happy 

[Brick]

I didn't realize that was the guy from Squid Game. 

[GeneticBlueprint]

On 5/24/2024 at 10:40 AM, GeneticBlueprint said:

 I'm rooting for Carrie Ann Moss

 

Spoiler

lol shiiiiittttt

 

[cusideabelincoln]

So far this is shaping up to be the worst piece of Star Wars media I've seen, right down there with Obi-wan and TRoS. The writing is truly awful and contrived. 

 

 

 

[Spork3245]

3 hours ago, cusideabelincoln said:

So far this is shaping up to be the worst piece of Star Wars media I've seen, right down there with Obi-wan and TRoS. The writing is truly awful and contrived. 

 

 

 

Was Obi-Wan bad? It definitely wasn’t memorable (because I barely remember it  ) but I remember enjoying all the scenes with Vader at least 

[GeneticBlueprint]

Mild spoilers that you probably deduced from the trailer
 

Having only watched the first episode I agree it’s not good so far. On top of yet another “padawan who left the Jedi order” story* that we’ve seen in other shows and games it just feels extremely “TV.” None of the actors are very good either. That voiceover with who the actual villain probably is at the end was extremely clunky—really, everything in the show has been very clunky—and again felt very TV. I’m dying for a proper high budget film at this point. 

 

* I wonder if she’s going to pick up a lightsaber at just the right moment and be a total badass

 

2 hours ago, Spork3245 said:

Was Obi-Wan bad? It definitely wasn’t memorable (because I barely remember it  ) but I remember enjoying all the scenes with Vader at least 

 

It was mostly bad and timeline ruining, unfortunately. 

[Kal-El814]

39 minutes ago, GeneticBlueprint said:

It was mostly bad and timeline ruining, unfortunately. 

 

Obi-Wan feels like a really long excuse to have an OP Force battle moment that doesn't really make any narrative or even thematic sense and lets Vader's ANH, "I sense something, a presence I've not felt since...," line do so much heavy lifting that @TUFKAK would herniate himself merely contemplating it. If you think of it as high budget fan fiction it's fine, beyond that... yikes?

 

Anyway haven't seen this show yet, gonna try to check it out soon.

[GeneticBlueprint]

1 minute ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

Obi-Wan feels like a really long excuse to have an OP Force battle moment that doesn't really make any narrative or even thematic sense and lets Vader's ANH, "I sense something, a presence I've not felt since...," line do so much heavy lifting that @TUFKAK would herniate himself merely contemplating it. If you think of it as high budget fan fiction it's fine, beyond that... yikes?

 

Anyway haven't seen this show yet, gonna try to check it out soon.

Yeah. And then ruins every other line. “Last time I was but the learner, now I am the master” means a lot less when you’ve had several encounters since your burning and betrayal so Obi Wan could learn some stuff or whatever. Or “You helped my father in the Clone Wars” seems a weird reference when you were basically a rescuer for that character. Why not “hey remember that last time we bonded and saved each other? That was nice. Again maybe?”

[Kal-El814]

1 minute ago, GeneticBlueprint said:

Yeah. And then ruins every other line. “Last time I was but the learner, now I am the master” means a lot less when you’ve had several encounters since your burning and betrayal so Obi Wan could learn some stuff or whatever. Or “You helped my father in the Clone Wars” seems a weird reference when you were basically a rescuer for that character. Why not “hey remember that last time we bonded and saved each other? That was nice. Again maybe?”

 

Yeah it's all that. I go back and forth on stuff like this... Star Wars came out in the seventies, I don't know where the line is between something one person said being able to dictate every other bit of media for a franchise almost 50 years later and just YOLOing it and doing whatever the hell you want. That's going to be different for different people, which is fine. But that last fight feels to me like it suffers from "diet Rise of Skywalker syndrome" where someone really took to heart the modern internet take that duel between Obi-Wan and Vader in ANH "sucked," "was choreographed badly," and that, "they didn't even use the Force during it," and decided to overcompensate for it. Which... fine I guess? I've seen fan edits of that duel that make them OP Jedi Saiyans, whatever. But it's weird to see that "correction" made in official media. 

 

So much of it comes down to execution. Rogue One is a fun movie for most of its time so the fact that a bunch of it makes no fucking sense (the pilot that got brain wormed turns out to be perfectly fine like 15 minutes later) and its entire raison d'être is unnecessary (there's no toilet bowl lid on the exhaust port) doesn't matter. And now it's given us Andor the show so those minor sins have been forgiven twice over. Obi-Wan adds little to the canon (Reva is cool but a bit bungled) and derps the rest.

[GeneticBlueprint]

7 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

Yeah it's all that. I go back and forth on stuff like this... Star Wars came out in the seventies, I don't know where the line is between something one person said being able to dictate every other bit of media for a franchise almost 50 years later and just YOLOing it and doing whatever the hell you want. That's going to be different for different people, which is fine. But that last fight feels to me like it suffers from "diet Rise of Skywalker syndrome" where someone really took to heart the modern internet take that duel between Obi-Wan and Vader in ANH "sucked," "was choreographed badly," and that, "they didn't even use the Force during it," and decided to overcompensate for it. Which... fine I guess? I've seen fan edits of that duel that make them OP Jedi Saiyans, whatever. But it's weird to see that "correction" made in official media. 

 

So much of it comes down to execution. Rogue One is a fun movie for most of its time so the fact that a bunch of it makes no fucking sense (the pilot that got brain wormed turns out to be perfectly fine like 15 minutes later) and its entire raison d'être is unnecessary (there's no toilet bowl lid on the exhaust port) doesn't matter. And now it's given us Andor the show so those minor sins have been forgiven twice over. Obi-Wan adds little to the canon (Reva is cool but a bit bungled) and derps the rest.

Agreed with all of that. Everyone has their own line. Obi Wan definitely crossed mine miles and miles back though. Which is a shame because that was the one story that sounded like it had potential. Old west Obi Wan or something. 

[CayceG]

I'm curious as more of the season comes out, but I'm likely going to wait. The major turnoff for me is that it's fully disconnected to the world and timeline we're used to (which I know is a draw for other people). But that plus it being all about Jedi vs. Sith means this just does not grab me. 

[legend]

11 hours ago, GeneticBlueprint said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

lol shiiiiittttt

 

 

Spoiler

I'm going to guess it's an elaborate ruse and a that she's actually alive.

 

A "trap" you might say.

 

[johnny]

I thought the first two episodes were good. Haters mad once again. 

[cusideabelincoln]

5 hours ago, Spork3245 said:

Was Obi-Wan bad? It definitely wasn’t memorable (because I barely remember it  ) but I remember enjoying all the scenes with Vader at least 

 

It was camp trying to take itself seriously. Inquisitors were so bad. The cat-and-mouse adventures were nonsensical. The Vader duel was vacuous spectacle. At least with a spectacle-driven show like Boba Fett they didn't try to give it the heft, seriousness, and gravitas like they tried with Ob-Wan, which is why I dislike it more.

[GeneticBlueprint]

40 minutes ago, legend said:

 

  Hide contents

I'm going to guess it's an elaborate ruse and a that she's actually alive.

 

A "trap" you might say.

 

 

Spoiler

I hope so because the trailers only seem to have footage from that opening scene… and she’s all that could really keep my interest in this show at this point. 

 

[GeneticBlueprint]

Also, do the lightsabers look weird to anybody? The blades seem like really thick round tubes which is what they are on set. I prefer the classic look. 

[Kal-El814]

34 minutes ago, cusideabelincoln said:

It was camp trying to take itself seriously. Inquisitors were so bad. The cat-and-mouse adventures were nonsensical. The Vader duel was vacuous spectacle. At least with a spectacle-driven show like Boba Fett they didn't try to give it the heft, seriousness, and gravitas like they tried with Ob-Wan, which is why I dislike it more.

 

The issue with The Inquisitors in a broad sense is that in a series where the bad guys are SO BAD and the Empire or FO will inevitably be undone by their hubris, you can only have so many faces of that incompetence before the mask kinda falls off. When you "rule of two" the Sith so it's just Vader and Sheev, their inability to see beyond their limitations is a compelling character flaw. When everyone in the Inquisitorius has the same flaw and is less interesting it just doesn't work. It's why Fallen Order does work well, there's only one real Inquisitor that's developed and the connection is personal, so the others that show up to be saber fodder are okay. With a whole show around a bunch of them, only one who is interesting with an angle beyond GRRR, and one of them has a death we KNOW will be retconned... it's just dumb.

[69los]

This is mediocre to bad so far; not RoS or Obi-Wan bad though. None of the characters nor the story draw me in. It's Star Wars though so I'll consume it. I'm more interested in the timeline and seeing the sights.

[sblfilms]

It makes me so sad that I have next to not desire to watch anything Star Wars related anymore. Disney has oversaturated us with content, it just doesn't feel special anymore. At least Disney has realized with Marvel that they need to slow it waaaay down. I think Star Wars needs even more breathing room between things than Marvel though!

[EternallDarkness]

haven't checked it out yet, but then I also haven't finished watching the last star wars series they put out.  Based on the interviews I have seen about this show...I don't know what to think. The director is saying it's cannon that R2 is a lesbian...and they are saying in episode 3 they are going to make it clear that the force is actually female? What in the hell does that even mean? What the hell happened to Star Wars? I miss the days when the controversy was just how stupid Jar Jar was. 

[GeneticBlueprint]

46 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

It makes me so sad that I have next to not desire to watch anything Star Wars related anymore. Disney has oversaturated us with content, it just doesn't feel special anymore. At least Disney has realized with Marvel that they need to slow it waaaay down. I think Star Wars needs even more breathing room between things than Marvel though!

I’m practically at this level. You’d wonder how if you saw my comic collection or bookshelf and various collectibles around my house. But a solid half of the TV offerings have just been bad. The other half has plenty in the “okay” range and a bit in the “great” range. The win rate here is just not encouraging. Go back to movies.

[Kal-El814]

After the first two episodes this is fine at worst and generally pretty good? I didn’t pay any attention to anything about this show pre release so I had no real notion of what it was going to be about. It has a bit of a YA vibe but not in a bad way unless that’s generally just not your thing. The Dead Space plasma cutter droid is cool, the droids that turned into chairs are cool. The performers are good and the show looks good.

 

i kinda don’t get what someone’s barometer would be calibrated to for them to think this is bad? It’s not hitting as hard as Andor and so far it doesn’t have the lore connects of something like Mando. But this is at least nominally what a lot of people said they wanted from the franchise to some extent… Jedi doing Jedi things, no real ties to Skywalkers, etc. We're only 1/4 way through so who knows where this will end up but I’m encouraged at this point. 
 

1 hour ago, sblfilms said:

It makes me so sad that I have next to not desire to watch anything Star Wars related anymore. Disney has oversaturated us with content, it just doesn't feel special anymore. At least Disney has realized with Marvel that they need to slow it waaaay down. I think Star Wars needs even more breathing room between things than Marvel though!

 

I think this is largely an awareness issue? Star Wars was only “special” during the old days if you mainly paid attention to the movies. There have always been comics and toys and games and cartoons and a whole extended literary universe that was, on the whole… fine? And often bad, sometimes good, whatever. But if someone wasn’t into the franchise enough to know those things existed or cared enough about them to think that they “count” then yeah the movies seemed special and felt like new Star Wars. There’s more TV content now and that stuff is harder to be unaware of I suppose. But this notion that Star Wars is recently becoming over saturated is just a vibe. 

[Greatoneshere]

3 hours ago, sblfilms said:

It makes me so sad that I have next to not desire to watch anything Star Wars related anymore. Disney has oversaturated us with content, it just doesn't feel special anymore. At least Disney has realized with Marvel that they need to slow it waaaay down. I think Star Wars needs even more breathing room between things than Marvel though!

 

2 hours ago, GeneticBlueprint said:

I’m practically at this level. You’d wonder how if you saw my comic collection or bookshelf and various collectibles around my house. But a solid half of the TV offerings have just been bad. The other half has plenty in the “okay” range and a bit in the “great” range. The win rate here is just not encouraging. Go back to movies.

 

I'm about where you guys are at. I've seen all of the film/TV content that Star Wars has come out with so far for the most part and at this point TV Star Wars (outside of Andor and parts of The Mandalorian) just feels cheaply shot and made and comes and goes with little fanfare after the initial hype.

 

2 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

After the first two episodes this is fine at worst and generally pretty good? I didn’t pay any attention to anything about this show pre release so I had no real notion of what it was going to be about. It has a bit of a YA vibe but not in a bad way unless that’s generally just not your thing. The Dead Space plasma cutter droid is cool, the droids that turned into chairs are cool. The performers are good and the show looks good.

 

So far this show isn't bad at all, I definitely get a YA vibe for sure (which is fine but not particularly my thing), it's fine so far. It's the most Star Wars has felt like a regular TV show since greasers jumped on space bikes in The Book of Boba Fett, most of the filmmaking feels flat and direct (with slow but solid action scenes). It is nice to see a different side to Star Wars than usual and seeing Force users resort to hand to hand combat rather than force powers and/or lightsabers is refreshing even if it comes off as a weak imitation of Crouching Tiger or The Matrix at times. I will say the Barash Vow Master Torbin Jedi force bubble meditation fight scene (the first confrontation) is exactly what I want from a Star Wars going back to an older time. More stuff like that, with wizard monks, etc.

 

I think for me the biggest issue is I'm just sort of bored. Like a Wookie jedi in live-action should be cause for excitement but everything just sort of feels like it comes and goes with most of these shows these days. I remember when The Mandalorian season 1 teaser trailer dropped back in the day and I was floored, couldn't have been more hyped for it. But after a number of shows that have brought down what was initially presented as pretty good quality with stuff like Obi-Wan, etc. has dampened a significant amount of my enthusiasm. The Acolyte just feels like more Star Wars in the same way a number of competent MCU TV shows have felt recently where they just sort of wash over you and in a year you barely remember what happened. I remember Star Wars media had moments that felt indelible and iconic. Now everything feels run of the mill and I think that's what some people are feeling. Still, not hating on The Acolyte at all, it's been solid enough, but with Star Wars that just isn't enough for me. But ever since The Force Awakens came out and changed the tone significantly of Star Wars (the prequels of course did plenty of damage already) I've slowly been checking out. I will say this show is getting absolutely eviscerated on both RT and IMDb with a current 5.4/10 (by audiences, not critics) and there's no really good reason why given every other Star Wars show rates in the 7's. This is definitely not worse than any of the other shows so far. There's also something to be said for live-action mattering more to people than other mediums when it comes to canon, caring about it, and exposure.

 

Fun fact: Leslye Headland, the creator and showrunner of The Acolyte, got her start as a staff writer on the cult hit show Terriers. She wrote episodes 5 and 12, and guess who directed episode 5 of that show? Rian Johnson, who had only done Brick and The Brothers Bloom by that point. Now they've both done a Star War. She also wrote and directed two really funny comedy movies, Bachelorette and Sleeping with Other People, as well as co-creating/co-showrunning season 1 of Russian Doll with Natasha Lyonne. By comparison to those four projects I'm not seeing that quality in The Acolyte yet. Even crazier is writer/director Kogonada, who did the incredible indie films Columbus and After Yang, is directing episodes 3 and 7 of this show. I hope it shows. 

 

[johnny]

2 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

After the first two episodes this is fine at worst and generally pretty good? I didn’t pay any attention to anything about this show pre release so I had no real notion of what it was going to be about. It has a bit of a YA vibe but not in a bad way unless that’s generally just not your thing. The Dead Space plasma cutter droid is cool, the droids that turned into chairs are cool. The performers are good and the show looks good.

 

i kinda don’t get what someone’s barometer would be calibrated to for them to think this is bad? It’s not hitting as hard as Andor and so far it doesn’t have the lore connects of something like Mando. But this is at least nominally what a lot of people said they wanted from the franchise to some extent… Jedi doing Jedi things, no real ties to Skywalkers, etc. We're only 1/4 way through so who knows where this will end up but I’m encouraged at this point. 
 

 

I think this is largely an awareness issue? Star Wars was only “special” during the old days if you mainly paid attention to the movies. There have always been comics and toys and games and cartoons and a whole extended literary universe that was, on the whole… fine? And often bad, sometimes good, whatever. But if someone wasn’t into the franchise enough to know those things existed or cared enough about them to think that they “count” then yeah the movies seemed special and felt like new Star Wars. There’s more TV content now and that stuff is harder to be unaware of I suppose. But this notion that Star Wars is recently becoming over saturated is just a vibe. 

star wars fans are miserable by default. andor is the last thing fans can agree was awesome since like empire strikes back? it’s always bitching bitching bitching like we’re watching The Crown or some shit and disney is fumbling away an emmy. only like half of the movies are good. 

 

genuinely can’t think of what to actually complain about in those two episodes. the dialogue wasn’t as good as people wanted it to be? good god. i think we got a bunch of cool characters, we got the jedi seemingly covering a scandal up on that girls home planet, and they’re probably gonna cover up the fact that the sith are around. not to mention we got some cool fight scenes and they’re not just whipping out their saber and slicing people. 

 

star wars fans will never be happy. and maybe this season will end up sucking! idk! but anybody complaining after those first two episodes needs a baby bottle. 

[Spork3245]

I’m with @johnnyon this one after watching the first two episodes. What’s there so far is “fine”. There isn’t enough to say it’s garbage or amazing yet. If you have Star Wars fatigue, sure, but nothing presented thus far was “this is garbage” IMO.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

After the first two episodes, I'll also say that it's "fine".  I guess?  Maybe?

 

I really can't see having strong feelings one way or another at this point because everything about it is just so very "languid".

[Greatoneshere]

7 hours ago, johnny said:

star wars fans are miserable by default. andor is the last thing fans can agree was awesome since like empire strikes back? it’s always bitching bitching bitching like we’re watching The Crown or some shit and disney is fumbling away an emmy. only like half of the movies are good. 

 

While this is an entirely fair assessment of some fans, outside of Andor and parts of The Mandalorian (which do meet the criteria of "prestige") I think expecting bigger budget, "prestige" TV more along the lines of Foundation, Game of Thrones, Wheel of Time, Rings of Power, House of the Dragon, etc. is also fair. No one is expecting Breaking Bad or The Sopranos or something with Star Wars, but hoping these shows would look better than 5-6 people on The Voice sets and sound stages whose costumes are weirdly looking more fake and more like CW costumes with each passing show is disappointing, to say the least. The aforementioned shows by comparison have more dynamic camera framing and movement, bigger and bolder sets not always on sound stages, scenes at times with more than just like 8 people standing around (though the other shows I mentioned are guilty of this too). 

 

Beyond those sorts of issues, as I said, I land where everyone in this thread has mostly landed, which this was fine. It's still early too, as you said. There's nothing to already hate this show so much (as I indicated many seem to on RT and IMDb which is stupid). But, there's nothing all that compelling about it either. It's the difference between when Moff Gideon shows up with his entourage on to the planet near the end of season 1 of The Mandalorian while Mando, etc. are bunkered down in a cantina and the Ludwig Gorranson soundtrack is thumping a remix of a classic Star Wars tune while a bunch of stormtroopers get in a line to fire and many of the other shows are just not that and don't really find any other voice in its stead to similarly get us excited at least. I don't care about fan service, I just want a really good show. Other SW shows can have their own tones, not everything needs to be Andor, but at the same time that doesn't mean shows have been entirely successful at doing their own thing but remaining compelling.