Television House of the Dragon: Season 2 (HBO | June 16) - Official Trailer

[SoberChef]

6 hours ago, Greatoneshere said:

Making Cristin Cole the Hand will work out great for Aegon, I'm sure. 

 

Plenty of shows have had the audience chomp at the proverbial bit for a particular characters' comeuppance. For Cole ... man I don't know the how of it, I just know it will be as gloriously gratifying as Trent's death in 2009's Friday the 13th. 

[Jwheel86]

Has HBO shown a blow job before? 

[69los]

36 minutes ago, Jwheel86 said:

Has HBO shown a blow job before? 

 

I think so.

 

Tell Me You Love Me had a bunch of explicit simulated sex scenes including a handjob scene but I don't recall blowjob scene.

[skillzdadirecta]

That was jarring and a bit much... not to mention it looked fake as hell.

[GeneticBlueprint]

Director taking script pitches from Dennis Reynolds apparently. 

[johnny]

that episode was amazing 

[Greatoneshere]

A big table setting episode that I imagine will lead into a very action packed episode 4. Rhaenyra and Alicent finally getting a chance to talk about Viserys' last words with Alicent realizing this whole war was started based on her misunderstanding her husband's last words was peak Alicent. Now that Rhaenyra has both the truth and peace of mind I imagine she can conduct this war with a clear mind going forward. Still unsure if Daemon is gathering an army for himself or his niece-wife, guess we'll see if the guilt wins out over his desire for the throne.

[GeneticBlueprint]

I like how Alicent, even after the clarity of Rhaenyra explaining what's what to her, still puts on the face of being in the right because she knows it's too late now. She can't go back on the actions she and the greens have taken. They'd be drawn and quartered for it. They are now both clear on the fact that war is inevitable.

 

I love how the fuccboi faction are now Kingsguards. I'm sure that will not backfire in any way.

[Greatoneshere]

2 hours ago, GeneticBlueprint said:

I like how Alicent, even after the clarity of Rhaenyra explaining what's what to her, still puts on the face of being in the right because she knows it's too late now. She can't go back on the actions she and the greens have taken. They'd be drawn and quartered for it. They are now both clear on the fact that war is inevitable.

 

I think a part of her, deep down, also has to admit to herself that she wanted to be queen, and that she wanted her kids to be next on the throne, not Rhaenyra and her kids. What was all of her suffering, seducing the king, listening to her father who basically pimped her out for power, what was it all for if not to put one of her kids on the throne? Alicent may have made a genuine mistake (a really stupid one, the king does a policy reversal he was staunch on for decades (Rhaenyra will be queen) only to change his mind with his last words? c'mon), but a part of her was inclined towards all of this too, even if she doesn't completely realize it consciously. 

[sblfilms]

Finally watched last week’s episode and I don’t think anything in GOT made me roll my eyes harder than the BJ shot. Real try hard energy there, HBO.

 

Anyway, the show rules. No other notes. Looking forward to tonight!

[Moa]

All I'm saying is that in a world with dragons, people would've figured out parachutes.

[GeneticBlueprint]

Love ya Rhaenys. You were a real one.

 

It was so sad watching the dragons fight, wound, and kill each other. So well done. When the light went out of Meleys' eyes as she looked at her rider and companion...  It was very good metaphor for the sadness this family should be feeling warring with each other.

 

Was Alicent for sure pregnant? Or did she just think she might be? Because if she knew for sure she was pregnant, and is only a few weeks out from Viserys' death then...

[TwinIon]

It seemed like only a matter of time before Prince Aemond ascended the throne, but I didn't think we'd see Aegon die such a cool death.

 

Excellent episode of TV.

[CastlevaniaNut18]

3 hours ago, TwinIon said:

It seemed like only a matter of time before Prince Aemond ascended the throne, but I didn't think we'd see Aegon die such a cool death.

 

Excellent episode of TV.

Hold your horses on that.

[GeneticBlueprint]

Yeah I think Aegon is alive. Aemond was walking up on him with the sword to finish him off until Cole spotted him.

[Firewithin]

last night

 

[TwinIon]

I imagine you're right, but I'm still inclined to believe that this has got to be at least the beginning of the end for him. I suppose both Joffery and Viserys did take forever to die, but it always seemed pretty inevitable that Aemond was going to end up on the throne.

[CastlevaniaNut18]

Spoiler:

 

 

Spoiler

Everyone dies. Well, nearly everyone. 

 

[Greatoneshere]

That was a banger of an episode of TV. We got to see a literal dance of dragons. No more Rhaenys sucks but they sent her off pretty well, losing to the strongest dragon rider and dragon in the whole show. I suspect we'll be gathering any Targaryen bastards at some point for both sides so they can get some more dragon riders I'd imagine given they had that one scene with that one bastard in the previous episode. 

[skillzdadirecta]

Glad you guys are enjoying this as much as I am... you do NOT want to see the dumpster fire that The House of The Dragon Reddit is 

Personally I think Rhaenys's death was strategically pretty dumb. She had the opportunity to escape and chose to to turn around despite being overmatched which made no sense to me.  Second mistake she's made in this series. She also seemed to be holding back, deliberately not commanding her dragon to use dragonfire while the brothers had no such compunctions. I believe this fight went down a little differently in the books?

[GeneticBlueprint]

In the book you kind of get the feeling she has a little bloodlust for being passed over as queen all that time back. At least from what I recall. 

[CastlevaniaNut18]

I kinda been wanting to watch this. I’ve read the book and remember a good bit of the lore and major events. 
 

Maybe I’ll start it soon. I think I at least have the first season on Plex. 

[GeneticBlueprint]

23 minutes ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

I kinda been wanting to watch this. I’ve read the book and remember a good bit of the lore and major events. 
 

Maybe I’ll start it soon. I think I at least have the first season on Plex. 

It’s very interesting the dual existence of the book and show. While the book is a dry history of things told to and witnessed by Maesters, the show is—for all intents and purposes—“what actually happened.” And it’s fun seeing where the maesters didn’t have the full context or how they erred. Or why they interpreted events the way they did. 

[skillzdadirecta]

9 hours ago, GeneticBlueprint said:

It’s very interesting the dual existence of the book and show. While the book is a dry history of things told to and witnessed by Maesters, the show is—for all intents and purposes—“what actually happened.” And it’s fun seeing where the maesters didn’t have the full context or how they erred. Or why they interpreted events the way they did. 

Isn't the book treated as a kind of biased view by the maesters who wrote it? If I recall

Spoiler

they definitely picked a side and portrayed Rhanerya as more of a villain than she may have been since they were writing during the reign of Aegon who actually won? For example in the book, they say that Aegon and Sunfyre killed Rhaenys and Melyse not Aemond and Vhagar which we see is what actually happened.

I haven't read the book in awhile and I'm out of town so I don't have it handy, but that's the way I always interpreted it. And the book goes all the way up to the conclusion of Robert's Rebellion, right?

[GeneticBlueprint]

3 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Isn't the book treated as a kind of biased view by the maesters who wrote it? If I recall

  Reveal hidden contents

they definitely picked a side and portrayed Rhanerya as more of a villain than she may have been since they were writing during the reign of Aegon who actually won? For example in the book, they say that Aegon and Sunfyre killed Rhaenys and Melyse not Aemond and Vhagar which we see is what actually happened.

I haven't read the book in awhile and I'm out of town so I don't have it handy, but that's the way I always interpreted it. And the book goes all the way up to the conclusion of Robert's Rebellion, right?

 

Yeah I haven't read it since it came out either but that's how I recall the events of this show being portrayed in the book.

[TwinIon]

10 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Personally I think Rhaenys's death was strategically pretty dumb. She had the opportunity to escape and chose to to turn around despite being overmatched which made no sense to me.  Second mistake she's made in this series. She also seemed to be holding back, deliberately not commanding her dragon to use dragonfire while the brothers had no such compunctions. I believe this fight went down a little differently in the books?

I agree about the death being pretty dumb, even if the sequence was rather spectacular.

 

I repeatedly thought we were seeing shots of her fleeing, only for her to turn around. For a castle that everyone already agreed was pretty worthless, it didn't seem like a worthwhile sacrifice to make. Not only her life, but losing the strategic value of a dragon. On the other hand, I don't know what the relative speeds of these dragons are. If she knew that Veghar could easily hunt her down, then it does probably make sense to turn and fight. 

[Fizzzzle]

Yes, the book is deliberately written from the perspective of an unreliable narrator. That's why the show is so much more interesting and has more room to play around.

 

And also, yes, (mild spoilers, I guess, though not really.. more vague concept spoilers)

Spoiler

Almost everyone dies

 

[Greatoneshere]

13 minutes ago, TwinIon said:

I agree about the death being pretty dumb, even if the sequence was rather spectacular.

 

I repeatedly thought we were seeing shots of her fleeing, only for her to turn around. For a castle that everyone already agreed was pretty worthless, it didn't seem like a worthwhile sacrifice to make. Not only her life, but losing the strategic value of a dragon. On the other hand, I don't know what the relative speeds of these dragons are. If she knew that Veghar could easily hunt her down, then it does probably make sense to turn and fight. 

 

I don't know that it was necessarily dumb, per se. Rewatching the ending again with Rhaenys, she seems to be heading away after Vhagar barbecues Aegon and Sunfyre but makes a strategic decision to turn around to continue defending the castle (which was her original mandate). She turns and looks at Vhagar before making this decision. It's considered. We may think it's a given she'll lose, but maybe she didn't. She seemed to think: "maybe I have a chance to end their ultimate weapon right here and now while defending the castle" and turns around to try and fight and she does make Vhagar smack into the ground. Remember, Rhaenys is the one who pushed Rhaenyra to try and broker peace this whole time, if she sees a shot at ending things right away (and killing Aemond and Vhagar would basically do just that), she's going to at least try to go for it, no? We should also consider how bad a look it is for Rhaenyra if Rhaenyra's envoy Rhaenys with a dragon abandons the castle and its men unceremoniously (in the first real House Black battle, ignoring the Bracken/Blackwood feud) without even trying to attack Vhagar and protect Rhaneyra's loyal lords. Probably not a great move politically when House Green has already won 3 houses/castles/fiefdoms to their side. There's a lot more to consider here for Rhaenys than just making sure she survives as easily as possible. 

 

But when she barely survives that initial attack on Vhagar, she does immediately try to head out and escape (probably realizing she does not, in fact, have a chance) but Vhagar gets the jump on her and by then it's too late. I think she hoped her attack would make Vhagar/Aemond retreat from their attack on the castle (thus allowing House Black a win) but Vhagar does not retreat and that's that. She overestimated herself and perhaps hoped to force a retreat which doesn't happen. I don't think that's dumb, I just think she took a gamble and lost which we think was a guaranteed loss but she clearly didn't think so. The fact she almost holds her own against Vhagar actually makes her case.

 

The lack of her making Meleys use dragonfire I didn't understand though, that was strange though she does use it thoroughly when she's tangling with Aemond and Vhagar in their "dance". 

[skillzdadirecta]

19 minutes ago, TwinIon said:

On the other hand, I don't know what the relative speeds of these dragons are. If she knew that Veghar could easily hunt her down, then it does probably make sense to turn and fight. 

Melyse is the fastest Dragon on the show at this point and was Rhanerya's biggest which is why it made even less sense that Rhaenys would go back and chose to fight a losing battle where the odds weren't in her favor. Daemon wanted her to team up with him to take down Vhagar and given how well Melyse faired in this fight, the two of them probably would have been able to do it. For her to go up against the oldest and biggest Dragon in existence at the time makes little sense especially, since that Dragon once belonged to her daughter I think? She's fully aware of what Vhagar is capable of. I think that was another narrative misstep they made with her character, the first being that she didn't preemptively end the war before it began when she could have. Also in this fight, they said in an interview that she orders Melyse to attack rather than breathe fire because she was focused on taking out the dragon and not the riders because they were her nephews. So not only was she fighting a losing battle, she was fighting it half heartedly. Still a great scene, cheapened by poor decisions made by the characters due to the needs of the narrative.

[skillzdadirecta]

19 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

The lack of her making Meleys use dragonfire I didn't understand though, that was strange though she does use it when she's tangling with Aemond and Vhagar in their "dance". 

 

[GeneticBlueprint]

I just read Rhaenys' turning back as her wanting to protect her allies and follow orders as @Greatoneshere points out. Meleys also had a spat with Vhagar and came out on top before getting stealth chomped. You can't just retreat every time Vhagar shows up.

[Greatoneshere]

1 hour ago, skillzdadirecta said:

So not only was she fighting a losing battle, she was fighting it half heartedly. Still a great scene, cheapened by poor decisions made by the characters due to the needs of the narrative.

 

As an alternative though, couldn't the character simply have been short sighted in this moment and/or motivated by other factors? Like, was Oberyn Martell dumb when he let hubris take the better of him in the fight with The Mountain just simply for the needs of that narrative or was that aspect a part of his character that made sense in that moment? I'm not trying to play devil's advocate, it depends on how well these decisions are presented in these (or any) shows. I think Rhaenys' decision to stay and try and fight Vhagar was within her character and made sense within the moment even if I don't like her decision and don't agree with it. I think it was earned though and she did try to leave immediately when that first attack didn't work out. 

[skillzdadirecta]

Strategically it made no sense for her to turn around and come back. Her heart clearly wasn't in the fight as the actress says in the interview (which is silly but ok) The stronghold wasn't that important strategically and she had already scored a potential victory by taking out one of the opposing side's dragons and possibly the king himself. What was there to gain by going back except what happened? Now, she's lost Rhaenyra one of her biggest weapons, the stronghold AND her life. I owuld have preferred if she hadn't had the opportunity to escape at all and lost then to have the character turn around and go back for vague reasons but that's me. Still a great episode but it was a silly decision.

 

45 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

Like, was Oberyn Martell dumb when he let hubris take the better of him in the fight with The Mountain just simply for the needs of that narrative or was that aspect a part of his character that made sense in that moment?

Well yes and no... Oberyn had already won the fight and was pretty certain that the Mountain was incapacitated due to not only being ran through TWICE and hamstrung but also poisoned by the deadliest poison in existence. I can forgive him for underestimating The Mountain's inhuman consitution because anyone else would have definitely been dead with the wound he inflicted on The Mountain.  That's completely different than what happened here.

 

Rhaenys was outgunned and was in a losing situation and wasn't even fighting with all she had which the actress confirms in the interview I posted. Again it was a great episode, but some of the plotting was alittle convoluted in my opinion. I suspect they did this to keep all of the people who read the book off-balance because we KNEW how this fight was going to turn out. This was their way to subvert expectations is my guess. 

[Greatoneshere]

11 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I owuld have preferred if she hadn't had the opportunity to escape at all and lost then to have the character turn around and go back for vague reasons but that's me. Still a great episode but it was a silly decision.

 

I understand what you're saying (that it wasn't the best strategic move) but that's sort of the entire point that I'm raising: that the reasons aren't actually all that vague. She overestimated her abilities (hence taking on Vhagar first, failing, then trying to retreat). She felt she could maybe end the war there and then to bring peace faster (a big thing with her). Running from Vhagar right away in your first battle is a bad look for House Black's side, to ditch the castle and retreat without trying regardless of the strategic importance of the castle itself, it would look bad politically. She also felt she could force Vhagar to retreat if she did try an attack if she couldn't necessarily beat Vhagar. These are all real reasons why one would turn back instead of continuing to run away initially. 

 

And I mean, yeah, the writers could have simply written an entirely different scenario which was far more definitive in terms of forcing Rhaneys's death against her will but that's not really a criticism of what they did go with. In terms of what they did go with, they gave Rhaenys an opportunity to leave and she chooses not to take it for the aforementioned reasons. Do you really find those reasons that hard to swallow? Lots of people do things like what she did for those kinds of reasons in real life (to not retreat when one should, etc.). Sometimes that gamble works out for a person and sometimes it doesn't, but it didn't feel unbelievable or dumb to me, it felt entirely within her character. Was it perfect? No, I'm not saying that but when watching it I didn't have any sense of disbelief at her decision. I didn't personally want her to turn around and even try to take on Vhagar (because I like the character and also for the reasons you gave) but I also get why she may have felt she needed to if she thought she could end the war, save her family, Corlys and countless innocent lives from continued bloodshed.

 

In a different universe she wins and we'd all be praising how badass it was that she turned around, took Vhagar on, and won to end the war (or heavily hurt House Green at least).

[skillzdadirecta]

26 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

She felt she could maybe end the war there and then to bring peace faster (a big thing with her).

She could have ended the war last season before it even started when she escaped with Melyse from the Dragon Pit. 

 

26 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

Running from Vhagar right away in your first battle is a bad look for House Black's side, to ditch the castle and retreat without trying regardless of the strategic importance of the castle itself, it would look bad politically.

How is it a bad look? The first thing one of the Lord of Rook's Roost men says to him when he sees Vhagar coming is "M'lord I think we should get you to safety." THEY even knew it was not a good position to be in and in fact, I wouldn't be surprised to find out that guy DID escape and brings news of what happened to Rhaenyra first hand. I don't think anyone would have begrudged her retreating stratigically in these circumstances, She was engaged with not one, but TWO dragons one being the biggest one in existence.

 

I mean Daemon himself said that he couln't beat Vhagar by himself but the two of them together could so I don't understand the sentiment that she thought she could turn the dragon back on her own. The actress basically says in the post that it turns into a suicide mission when she references The Samurai. My question is what was the point of sacrificing your self and an asset like this for a location that was of little strategic importance.

 

26 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

And I mean, yeah, the writers could have simply written an entirely different scenario which was far more definitive in terms of forcing Rhaneys's death against her will but that's not really a criticism of what they did go with. In terms of what they did go with, they gave Rhaenys an opportunity to leave and she chooses not to take it for the aforementioned reasons.

Yes it is a criticism and I stated the reason why. Agree with them or not, but I made it very clear several times what my issue with what was done her was.

 

26 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

Do you really find those reasons that hard to swallow?

Yes I do for the reasons I stated above and in other posts. makes no sense given the context in my opinion. 

 

26 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

I didn't personally want her to turn around and even try to take on Vhagar (because I like the character and also for the reasons you gave) but I also get why she may have felt she needed to if she thought she could end the war, save her family, Corlys and countless innocent lives from continued bloodshed.

Again, she had the opportunity to do that last season. She didn't.  

 

At the end of the day, it's minor complaint. It was still a good episode, but this bit of plotting felt forced to me because they were trying to subvert book readers expectations while staying true to the narrative at the same time. Her motivations for turning around and going back to fight a losing battle half heartedly (Which you haven't addressed) make very little sense to me. If you're going to fight against a stronger foe, go all out. You almost get the sense she WANTED to die in battle which makes ZERO sense if that's the case.