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Gaza/Israel Update (09/02): general strike/mass protests in Israel pressure Netanyahu to agree to cease-fire deal


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Just now, johnny said:

how is it a hamas rocket if the size of the blast doesn’t line up with what hamas is capable of? like a hamas rocket but then one of this interceptor rockets IDF has? i’m not familiar with all this war technology 

 

The rockets typically launched by Hamas/PIJ into Israel from urban areas in Gaza usually contain relatively small warheads because there isn't a lot of room to launch their larger munitions (which as far as I'm aware were all eliminated by Israel during one of the previous conflicts).

 

Now, an Israeli interceptor munition of the sort used by the Iron Dome system doesn't have that large of a warhead either which is why I still maintain that the munitiom involved was a guided AGM.

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5 minutes ago, johnny said:

how is it a hamas rocket if the size of the blast doesn’t line up with what hamas is capable of? like a hamas rocket but then one of this interceptor rockets IDF has? i’m not familiar with all this war technology 

 

If it was a Hamas rocket, it's one they haven't fielded often (or at all) before.  If (big if) this is the case, that kind of lends credence to the theory that the rocket experienced a RUD during it's boost phase, as it's an unproven vehicle.  Solid rocket motors can fail without any forewarning. 

 

I think the most likely scenario is that it was an Israeli rocket that targeted that location.  If they did target that location, I would think the most likely answer is because of bad intel.  I don't think Israel is stupid enough to target a hospital that holds no military significance, as the blow back they would receive from western supporters would not be worth it.  

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It's looking likely that this was an Israeli munition, but it's certainly not yet conclusive. I'm not even posting in the Resetera thread, because they are already going full conspiratorial that it was Israel and ignoring any calls for level-headedness. Like...yes, it probably was Israel. But it could have been Hamas. Or it could have been Israel, but an accident (in terms of either a miss, or bad intel). We'll know more over the next 24/7 as additional footage comes out and the actual hospital can be seen in the daylight.

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3 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said:

It's looking likely that this was an Israeli munition, but it's certainly not yet conclusive. I'm not even posting in the Resetera thread, because they are already going full conspiratorial that it was Israel and ignoring any calls for level-headedness. Like...yes, it probably was Israel. But it could have been Hamas. Or it could have been Israel, but an accident (in terms of either a miss, or bad intel). We'll know more over the next 24/7 as additional footage comes out and the actual hospital can be seen in the daylight.

I’m fairly anti-Israel (IDF really) and I can’t even stomach that thread. They go hard to the extremes on every issue it seems like. 
 

This hospital event is going to drastically change the calculus here unfortunately. 

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19 minutes ago, Comet said:

I’m fairly anti-Israel (IDF really) and I can’t even stomach that thread. They go hard to the extremes on every issue it seems like. 
 

This hospital event is going to drastically change the calculus here unfortunately. 

I’m of the opinion that westerners in general like to view Israel negatively to assuage their own guilt over the greatest humanitarian crisis that we started. If we can blame Israel it releases us of culpability for it.  
 

Meanwhile the US invaded two whole ass countries and killed over a million people because two buildings got knocked down, but Israel is just the worst.

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1 minute ago, TUFKAK said:

I’m of the opinion that westerners in general like to view Israel negatively to assuage their own guilt over the greatest humanitarian crisis that we started. If we can blame Israel it releases us of culpability for it.  
 

Meanwhile the US invaded two whole ass countries and killed over a million people because two buildings got knocked down, but Israel is just the worst.

Not sure that’s really the case in this community. You will find that historically people here who have been against some IDF actions were also largely against efforts in Iraq and Afghanistan. The moral maze here is so complex that generalizing to  “westerners”   quickly loses any value. 

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8 minutes ago, Comet said:

Not sure that’s really the case in this community. You will find that historically people here who have been against some IDF actions were also largely against efforts in Iraq and Afghanistan. The moral maze here is so complex that generalizing to  “westerners”   quickly loses any value. 

I’m talking about the holocaust then the mandate. There is one group of people ultimately responsible for what’s happening today, both current combatants have their place too don’t get me wrong, but hating Israel allows them to ignore our own culpability in this disaster.

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14 minutes ago, TUFKAK said:

I’m talking about the holocaust then the mandate. There is one group of people ultimately responsible for what’s happening today, both current combatants have their place too don’t get me wrong, but hating Israel allows them to ignore our own culpability in this disaster.

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My wild-ass guess of how a Hamas rocket could do this is that the engine flamed out and the rocket fell, detonating the warhead, which then detonated the fuel. Detonating rocket fuel would probably cause a much larger explosion than the warhead itself. 

 

 

I think it's possible. Maybe even plausible. But also... it's more likely Israel bombed a hospital because they've done that before. This is a level of destruction heretofore unseen from Hamas rocket launches. 

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9 minutes ago, CayceG said:

My wild-ass guess of how a Hamas rocket could do this is that the engine flamed out and the rocket fell, detonating the warhead, which then detonated the fuel. Detonating rocket fuel would probably cause a much larger explosion than the warhead itself. 

 

 

I think it's possible. Maybe even plausible. But also... it's more likely Israel bombed a hospital because they've done that before. This is a level of destruction heretofore unseen from Hamas rocket launches. 

 

I still keep coming back to the "whine" from the Washington Post video prior to the impact/detonation.  That's just too indicative of actual engine propulsion for me at this point.

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9 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

I still keep coming back to the "whine" from the Washington Post video prior to the impact/detonation.  That's just too indicative of actual engine propulsion for me at this point.

 

I wonder if a failed/failing rocket engine could do that. 

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17 minutes ago, CayceG said:

My wild-ass guess of how a Hamas rocket could do this is that the engine flamed out and the rocket fell, detonating the warhead, which then detonated the fuel. Detonating rocket fuel would probably cause a much larger explosion than the warhead itself. 

 

 

I think it's possible. Maybe even plausible. But also... it's more likely Israel bombed a hospital because they've done that before. This is a level of destruction heretofore unseen from Hamas rocket launches. 

 

Have we seen other rockets falling short creating a blast that big though? Seems like it be a regular thing given the fail rate. 

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1 minute ago, Jwheel86 said:

 

Have we seen other rockets falling short creating a blast that big though? Seems like it be a regular thing given the fail rate. 

 

This is what swings me the other way. This just seems so incredibly different than what we've seen. 

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12 minutes ago, Jwheel86 said:

 

Have we seen other rockets falling short creating a blast that big though? Seems like it be a regular thing given the fail rate. 

 

Not that I'm aware of which means that it's either a case of significantly larger warhead than the typical Hamas/PIJ munition or the "normal" warhead detonated an accelerant  (oxygen, fuel, etc.) in the hospital as @TUFKAK indicated.

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