legend Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 12 hours ago, Kal-El814 said: Pausing real time combat makes sense if you're straight up "porting" a pen and paper system a la Baldur's Gate I and II, Iceland Dale, etc. Those systems aren't "real time" literally but involve time passing in specific intervals to do things and there's just too much going on when you're controlling 6 PCs facing 10+ enemies. Other than that, I think it makes much more sense to design a real time combat system that doesn't require that. Why does the source material matter? If the resulting gameplay is fun then other games can adopt it too regardless of whether they're adapting the same kind of source material; and if the resulting gameplay isn't fun, then you have a bad game that isn't worth playing or porting and the source material won't change that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 1 hour ago, legend said: Why does the source material matter? If the resulting gameplay is fun then other games can adopt it too regardless of whether they're adapting the same kind of source material; and if the resulting gameplay isn't fun, then you have a bad game that isn't worth playing or porting and the source material won't change that. If they want to change things up they should just make a KOTOR 3. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legend Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 7 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said: If they want to change things up they should just make a KOTOR 3. I'd have no objections to that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 23 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said: If they want to change things up they should just make a KOTOR 3. They did make KOTOR 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 5 minutes ago, Chris- said: They did make KOTOR 3 It got canceled but yes, they were technically making a KOTOR 3 to some degree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 18 minutes ago, best3444 said: It got canceled but yes, they were technically making a KOTOR 3 to some degree. He means TOR so basically stealing my line. Shame on him! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Chris- said: They did make KOTOR 3 As well as KOTOR 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and 9! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodyHell Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Keyser_Soze said: If they want to change things up they should just make a KOTOR 3. Or, just make the original with much better combat, and then do 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, BloodyHell said: Or, just make 2 and actually ship a finished product this time, and then do 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-El814 Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 3 hours ago, legend said: Why does the source material matter? If the resulting gameplay is fun then other games can adopt it too regardless of whether they're adapting the same kind of source material; and if the resulting gameplay isn't fun, then you have a bad game that isn't worth playing or porting and the source material won't change that. I’m probably not explaining myself well. Something like Dragon Age Origins works because even though there are dice rolls, real time combat you can pause, etc., it really feels as though it’s designed as a videogame first. Games like Baldur’s Gate I and II work because they’re using a vetted rule set that’s adapted digitally as literally as possible. I think both of those games/series have aged relatively well (even though I acknowledge that someone without pen and paper RPG experience will go into Baldur’s Gate I and II and likely have a MISERABLE time since they’re so much more rigid than modern videogames and honestly modern pen and paper RPGs as well). To me, KOTOR combat has always felt like a weird hedge between where BioWare came from and where it ended up. I kinda feel that way about the first Mass Effect as well, though it obviously leans more towards videogames whereas KOTOR leans more towards tabletop. It’s not that KOTOR doesn’t WORK, it’s 100% a vibe thing for me. … I don’t know if that helps at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 24 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said: I’m probably not explaining myself well. Something like Dragon Age Origins works because even though there are dice rolls, real time combat you can pause, etc., it really feels as though it’s designed as a videogame first. Games like Baldur’s Gate I and II work because they’re using a vetted rule set that’s adapted digitally as literally as possible. I think both of those games/series have aged relatively well (even though I acknowledge that someone without pen and paper RPG experience will go into Baldur’s Gate I and II and likely have a MISERABLE time since they’re so much more rigid than modern videogames and honestly modern pen and paper RPGs as well). To me, KOTOR combat has always felt like a weird hedge between where BioWare came from and where it ended up. I kinda feel that way about the first Mass Effect as well, though it obviously leans more towards videogames whereas KOTOR leans more towards tabletop. It’s not that KOTOR doesn’t WORK, it’s 100% a vibe thing for me. … I don’t know if that helps at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodyHell Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 45 minutes ago, Jason said: Nobody cares about 2. KotOR is one of the most important games of that decade. I'd be fine with a KotOR 2 remake, but definitely not over the original. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legend Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 49 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said: I’m probably not explaining myself well. Something like Dragon Age Origins works because even though there are dice rolls, real time combat you can pause, etc., it really feels as though it’s designed as a videogame first. Games like Baldur’s Gate I and II work because they’re using a vetted rule set that’s adapted digitally as literally as possible. I think both of those games/series have aged relatively well (even though I acknowledge that someone without pen and paper RPG experience will go into Baldur’s Gate I and II and likely have a MISERABLE time since they’re so much more rigid than modern videogames and honestly modern pen and paper RPGs as well). To me, KOTOR combat has always felt like a weird hedge between where BioWare came from and where it ended up. I kinda feel that way about the first Mass Effect as well, though it obviously leans more towards videogames whereas KOTOR leans more towards tabletop. It’s not that KOTOR doesn’t WORK, it’s 100% a vibe thing for me. … I don’t know if that helps at all. That might help It sounds like you're saying you felt like KOTOR lacked a clear vision about what kind of game mechanics it wanted to have and ultimately compromised between different visions, rather than choosing one. Is that right? I don't think I really felt like it compromised myself, but I can understand that view better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-El814 Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 8 minutes ago, legend said: That might help It sounds like you're saying you felt like KOTOR lacked a clear vision about what kind of game mechanics it wanted to have and ultimately compromised between different visions, rather than choosing one. Is that right? I don't think I really felt like it compromised myself, but I can understand that view better. Yeah that’s more or less where I land. DA:O feels like a video game. BG I and II feel like digital versions of pen and paper RPGs. KOTOR feels like a hedge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 21, 2022 Author Share Posted January 21, 2022 2 hours ago, BloodyHell said: Nobody cares about 2. KotOR is one of the most important games of that decade. I'd be fine with a KotOR 2 remake, but definitely not over the original. KOTOR II is so very superior to the first game when the "complete" version is played that it's not even a comparison. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said: KOTOR II is so very superior to the first game when the "complete" version is played that it's not even a comparison. And you can tell that the Nihilus fight is right about when Obsidian got told to just ship whatever they had, given how anticlimactic just taking his mask and leaving was after all the buildup. The game reaches way higher highs than the first game. Nothing from the first game is as memorable as being inserted onto Onderon in the middle of a civil war breaking out in the old Mandalorian war droid and both sides freaking out at the sight of the droid and it turning into a three-way free-for-all clusterfuck. The fact that Obsidian wasn't allowed to finish the game is the only reason it's not talked about the same way as the first game but given the highs they managed to reach in the gimped version, a finished version clearly would have eclipsed the first game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legend Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 2 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said: KOTOR II is so very superior to the first game when the "complete" version is played that it's not even a comparison. The fan reconstruction to get closer to the "complete" version is better than the shipped version, but it still feels very unfinished. I'd say 2 very clearly had the potential to be better, but still falls short because of the incompleteness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 2 hours ago, legend said: The fan reconstruction to get closer to the "complete" version is better than the shipped version, but it still feels very unfinished. I'd say 2 very clearly had the potential to be better, but still falls short because of the incompleteness. Which is why a remake that includes all of the planned content is more needed than a KOTOR 1 remake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodyHell Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 2 hours ago, Jason said: Which is why a remake that includes all of the planned content is more needed than a KOTOR 1 remake. People want a remake of 1 far more than 2. If you polled it on a large gaming news site, it wouldn't be close. The idea that 2 is better "if you include all the stuff we didn't get in its original release" doesn't hold up. Personally, if I was going to ask for part 2 of something, it would be Jade Empire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brick Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 I'm sure if this does well we could see a remake of II as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legend Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 13 hours ago, Jason said: Which is why a remake that includes all of the planned content is more needed than a KOTOR 1 remake. Perhaps, but it would be weird to start with a full KOTOR 2 remake instead of a KOTOR 1 remake. Seems like they should just do both and then do a proper third! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted May 19, 2022 Author Share Posted May 19, 2022 Saber Interactive joins development of Star Wars KOTOR remake (Eurogamer) Quote Evil Dead developer Saber Interactive has joined up with Aspyr to work on the upcoming Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic remake. During the Q4 Embracer Group report, board member Matthew Karch revealed that Aspyr and Saber Interactive were now working together on the remake, calling it a "massive product". "Aspyr has gone full in to make this the best game that they can make. When we acquired Aspyr, we knew from the start that they would require our assistance [and] Saber has tremendous expertise in creating these types of products," he said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firewithin Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 Whelp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 That is unfortunate because that's one remake I was really looking forward to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted July 26, 2022 Author Share Posted July 26, 2022 Just cancel the bloody thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firewithin Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 11 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said: Just cancel the bloody thing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nublood Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 2 hours ago, best3444 said: That is unfortunate because that's one remake I was really looking forward to. Meee tooooo!! I hope they get this sorted out and soon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted July 27, 2022 Author Share Posted July 27, 2022 Who among us could've guessed that entrusting a project of this scope and scale to a developer whose entire portfolio consists of Mac and mobile ports of older titles could've led to this outcome. Who among us indeed? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legend Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 54 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said: Who among us could've guessed that entrusting a project of this scope and scale to a developer whose entire portfolio consists of Mac and mobile ports of older titles could've led to this outcome. Who among us indeed? I would have really enjoyed a FF7R style remake of KOTOR, but I guess they were not the ones to do that anyway though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 Give it to Obsidian or Blue Point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 2 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said: Who among us could've guessed that entrusting a project of this scope and scale to a developer whose entire portfolio consists of Mac and mobile ports of older titles could've led to this outcome. Who among us indeed? Stick with me. I had no faith from the beginning! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HGLatinBoy Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 7 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said: Just cancel the bloody thing. What about the money Sony paid? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HGLatinBoy Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 1 hour ago, ManUtdRedDevils said: Give it to Obsidian or Blue Point. “Well hello there!” - Xbox Studios 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brick Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 4 hours ago, HGLatinBoy said: “Well hello there!” - Xbox Studios This is a Star Wars related thread; you could have just said "Hello there", come on man! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Vic20 Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 Another cautionary tale: They know what we love, and they really want our money. This adds up to plenty of projects that are nothing more than nostalgia mirages. As gamers, our policy should be a big old wait and see approach regarding resurrected legends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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