Alpha1Cowboy Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 14 hours ago, Keyser_Soze said: But how angry would you have been if she was black and deaf? Shit I would have loved that. Michelle Banks would have been awesome for that part. She was one of the possible actresses who I initially suggested during the Oscars discussion I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 24 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said: Why does James Bond need to be a man? A: Because his name is James I say, here is a woman named James, not she should play James Bond. Fake news. Her name is Jaime. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nublood Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 IMO this just reeks of pandering. It should feel organic but instead feels like an attempt to check some SJW boxes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 On 8/13/2018 at 10:59 AM, Alpha1Cowboy said: Why does James Bond need to be a man? Because masculinity is integral to the character; he is meant to be the personification of the male (specifically, British) id. Unlike skin tone - which has no bearing on who or what Bond is as a character - changing Bond's gender would fundamentally change the underlying character. That said, I would totally be fine with a 'Jane Bond', because I'm not a nerd and I don't give a shit about casting purity. But regardless of how I feel, it's a bad comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted August 14, 2018 Author Share Posted August 14, 2018 4 minutes ago, nublood said: IMO this just reeks of pandering. It should feel organic but instead feels like an attempt to check some SJW boxes. What would feel organic, exactly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Idris Elba is an accomplished British actor who has been lauded for his charm and good looks; his turn as Bond as been pined for by numerous fans online. But you're right, it's totally pandering. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpha1Cowboy Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 3 hours ago, Chris- said: Because masculinity is integral to the character; he is meant to be the personification of the male (specifically, British) id. Unlike skin tone - which has no bearing on who or what Bond is as a character - changing Bond's gender would fundamentally change the underlying character. That said, I would totally be fine with a 'Jane Bond', because I'm not a nerd and I don't give a shit about casting purity. But regardless of how I feel, it's a bad comparison. I would say that you are tiptoeing the line here. The character is a product of the cold war era British Agent...the first novel came out in 1953....so your assessment is semi correct in that "he is meant to be the personification of the male (specifically, British) id"...but color plays into that..... unless you think MI-6 had prominent black agents post WW2. Even today MI5 and MI6 are trying to shake off that very image that you just connected with Bond http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5766701/MI6-attempts-shake-macho-James-Bond-image-bid-encourage-women.html So any Bond in the modern world can be anything really...because it doesn't have to be tied to the cold war Bond Image of an MI-6 Agent. My take...a modern bond in the modern worldcan be open to interpretation.......a Bond based on the cold war era fictional creation....not so much. Personally..I like the take of creating another Agent persona and running with it. Heck..really make it fun and have Bond die.....and pass the torch. )I don't know...once the boomers are gone is the Bond Franchise really relevant? But this is definitely a fun discussion. I just saw this and thought..hmm.. https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/people-outraged-jack-whitehalls-playing-disneys-first-openly-gay-character-jungle-cruise-damn-shame-150335651.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 2 minutes ago, Alpha1Cowboy said: I would say that you are tiptoeing the line here. The character is a product of the cold war era British Agent...the first novel came out in 1953....so your assessment is semi correct in that "he is meant to be the personification of the male (specifically, British) id"...but color plays into that..... unless you think MI-6 had prominent black agents post WW2. Even today MI5 and MI6 are trying to shake off that very image that you just connected with Bond http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5766701/MI6-attempts-shake-macho-James-Bond-image-bid-encourage-women.html So any Bond in the modern world can be anything really...because it doesn't have to be tied to the cold war Bond Image of an MI-6 Agent. My take...a modern bond in the modern worldcan be open to interpretation.......a Bond based on the cold war era fictional creation....not so much. Personally..I like the take of creating another Agent persona and running with it. Heck..really make it fun and have Bond die.....and pass the torch. )I don't know...once the boomers are gone is the Bond Franchise really relevant? I'm not tip-toeing a line, you are conflating characterization and historical accuracy. Fictional characters are not defined by their fidelity to reality, let alone a character who has been played by seven different people over the past five decades. You could make a 60s Cold War-era Bond film with a black actor, and it may not be historically accurate, but it wouldn't change the underlying narrative or character arcs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 14 minutes ago, Alpha1Cowboy said: I would say that you are tiptoeing the line here. The character is a product of the cold war era British Agent...the first novel came out in 1953....so your assessment is semi correct in that "he is meant to be the personification of the male (specifically, British) id"...but color plays into that..... unless you think MI-6 had prominent black agents post WW2. Even today MI5 and MI6 are trying to shake off that very image that you just connected with Bond http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5766701/MI6-attempts-shake-macho-James-Bond-image-bid-encourage-women.html So any Bond in the modern world can be anything really...because it doesn't have to be tied to the cold war Bond Image of an MI-6 Agent. My take...a modern bond in the modern worldcan be open to interpretation.......a Bond based on the cold war era fictional creation....not so much. Personally..I like the take of creating another Agent persona and running with it. Heck..really make it fun and have Bond die.....and pass the torch. )I don't know...once the boomers are gone is the Bond Franchise really relevant? But this is definitely a fun discussion. I just saw this and thought..hmm.. https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/people-outraged-jack-whitehalls-playing-disneys-first-openly-gay-character-jungle-cruise-damn-shame-150335651.html NOW you're getting it... to me if they REALLY wanted a Bond that reflected modern times, they would cast an British Bond of Middle Eastern decent rather than a Black Bond (although I'm not opposed to that) OR... a Bi-sexual Bond Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALIEN-gunner Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Bond was quite defined as a white man in the books and he's the same character throughout every film. Casting any other race or sex would be weird. Idris Elba could do it but why would he want to? He could play the part of another double-O agent in the next 007 film or a spin off. He could make that character into a better Agent and better film than any of the past 007 movies. He shouldn't have to play the part of a white man. He should be original. Established characters should stay how they are. No one wants a white Blade or a Asian Black Panther. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nublood Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 7 minutes ago, ALIEN-gunner said: Bond was quite defined as a white man in the books and he's the same character throughout every film. Casting any other race or sex would be weird. Idris Elba could do it but why would he want to? He could play the part of another double-O agent in the next 007 film or a spin off. He could make that character into a better Agent and better film than any of the past 007 movies. He shouldn't have to play the part of a white man. He should be original. Established characters should stay how they are. No one wants a white Blade or a Asian Black Panther. This is the point I was trying to make. I keep hearing things like "it's time for a black bond" or whatever. No, it's not. What it's time for is for people to accept that some things shouldn't be changed because of reasons. What's sad is there were plenty of actors eagerly waiting for this role. But now they will be dismissed because we have to endure this experiment where we appease the bloggers, activists, commentators and other pejorative termed groups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 I've never watched a Bond movie and I probably never will, but I can't grasp the reasoning people have against a black Bond. There's literally no reason why there shouldn't be one. And Idris Elba is fiiiiiine and I could easily see him in the role. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 The fact that they let an Irishman from the Republic of Ireland play a British agent should put to rest any arguments about who can or cannot play James Bond. Hell, I'd rather have a black Limey playing 007 than a white Paddy who is probably an IRA sympathizer at heart.p A fucking Irishman should NEVER play 007. NEVER! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALIEN-gunner Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 8 minutes ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said: I've never watched a Bond movie and I probably never will... Most people who are trying to get this to happen don't care about the series either. They don't care about the character at all and just want to change things for no good reason I can think of than to stir shit up and piss off fans. That's dumb. I like the Bond films and want them to stay pure. I also love the Blade films and would complain if an Asian or white man tried play the part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Just now, ALIEN-gunner said: I like the Bond films and want them to stay pure. The fact that a goddamned Irishman played Bond means that their "purity" ended a long time ago. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Saying you want to keep Bond white to remain "pure" comes off reeeeeeeeallllly bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinIon Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 4 minutes ago, nublood said: This is the point I was trying to make. I keep hearing things like "it's time for a black bond" or whatever. No, it's not. What it's time for is for people to accept that some things shouldn't be changed because of reasons. What's sad is there were plenty of actors eagerly waiting for this role. But now they will be dismissed because we have to endure this experiment where we appease the bloggers, activists, commentators and other pejorative termed groups. Two things. 1. "some things shouldn't be changed because of reasons."? Really? maybe not any good reasons. Especially for a modern Bond, there's no particularly good reason the actor needs to be white. I think the actor needs to have charisma, and needs to be physically capable, but there's no good reason they need to be white. 2. There is actually a worthwhile reason to change an established character, rather than invent new ones out of whole cloth. There's a good reason that when you make a spy movie, the ones with new characters get made for $30M, new franchises based on existing properties get double that, and proven franchises get $150M+. You're getting a fundamentally different film when you put someone in "cool new spy movie" for $30M vs putting them in a $150M Bond movie. We can complain about the facts of franchise filmmaking, but it's a reality that should be considered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Elba is English, sexy, charming, and the right age. Isn't that everything Bond is supposed to be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said: Elba is English... I will allow for Bond to be from the constituent parts of the United Kingdom, which would allow for actors from England, Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. But an actor from the bloody Republic of Ireland?!?! That was bullshit and he it showed because he TOTALLY SUCKED as 007. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinIon Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, ALIEN-gunner said: Most people who are trying to get this to happen don't care about the series either. They don't care about the character at all and just want to change things for no good reason I can think of than to stir shit up and piss off fans. That's dumb. I like the Bond films and want them to stay pure. I also love the Blade films and would complain if am Asian or white man tried play the part. Were you one of the people who were angry that we got a Bond with blue eyes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALIEN-gunner Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 4 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said: The fact that a goddamned Irishman played Bond means that their "purity" ended a long time ago. Looking the part is all that matters. Just like Ruby Rose can play the part of a Jewish character without actually being Jewish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Just now, ALIEN-gunner said: Looking the part is all that matters. Just like Ruby Rose can play the part of a Jewish character without actually being Jewish. HE'S STILL A FUCKING PADDY AND NO FUCKING PADDY SHOULD EVER BE ALLOWED TO PLAY 007! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALIEN-gunner Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, TwinIon said: Were you one of the people who were angry that we got a Bond with blue eyes? No but with Blonde hair? Yeah kinda. Daniel Craig was a miscast in my opinion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 6 minutes ago, ALIEN-gunner said: Just like Ruby Rose can play the part of a Jewish character without actually being Jewish. On what planet does this woman look like she's Jewish? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Somehow I doubt AG was as angry and used words like "pure" when Craig was cast as Bond. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nublood Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 44 minutes ago, ALIEN-gunner said: No but with Blonde hair? Yeah kinda. Daniel Craig was a miscast in my opinion. Yea, I'm going to have to hugely disagree on that one. Red card for you bruh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 So blonde Bond is okay, Black Bond isn't. You are really transparent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nublood Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 1 hour ago, ALIEN-gunner said: Most people who are trying to get this to happen don't care about the series either. They don't care about the character at all and just want to change things for no good reason I can think of than to stir shit up and piss off fans. That's dumb. I like the Bond films and want them to stay pure. I also love the Blade films and would complain if an Asian or white man tried play the part. Nothing about Blade necessitates him being black or even being a dude, so an Asian or female Blade wouldn't be a problem. Black Panther is different since he's you know... an African Prince. There HAS been a female Black Panther though so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 3 minutes ago, nublood said: Roll your eyes all you want, I've yet to hear a good reason why James Bond can't be black. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 and I STILL haven't been told what the guillotine means. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Just now, skillzdadirecta said: and I STILL haven't been told what the guillotine means. We're not sure either, but it looks cool! It doesn't have an impact on your reputation score, but most people use it for either (a) disapproval of the comment, (b) approval of a comment that involves how terrible the ultra-rich are and what should be done with them, or (c) it looks cool. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
number305 Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Glad we got this settled. So everyone is cool with a Blade remake staring James McAvoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Just now, number305 said: Glad we got this settled. So everyone is cool with a Blade remake staring James McAvoy I've never seen Blade, so I don't have an opinion. But skillz, who is in the movie industry and is black, said nothing about Blade necessitates him being black, so I guess you got your answer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Christ, how utterly fucking boring would the the arts, pop culture, etc., be if things could never look or be different? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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